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    multi_system_fan

    @multi_system_fan

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    Best posts made by multi_system_fan

    • RE: Alternative to pairwise matrix

      @rob yeah, this is definetely an easier visual then those number-overload!
      I think the easier graphics will allow more complexity in details because voters will feel they already undetsnd "enough" of it to feel good about it.
      Most people don't try understanding every detail, just a good-enough-intuition.

      posted in Voting Methods
      multi_system_fan
      multi_system_fan
    • RE: New Simple Condorcet Method - Basically Copeland+Margins

      @sass I think tiebraking rules are complex and based on intuitions, values, assumptions, (mis)understandings, personal hisorical experiences (good and bad) and this fuzziness. This makes them them very vulnerable to say bad press or campaigning of other voteting-method activists. Therefore I would prefer to adjust your method: remove all tiebraking rules and let voters vote about it on the same ballot as the main vote:
      Most elections have a unique winner but sometimes ties can occur what shoud happen according to you?
      1 new election
      2 random selection
      3 highest average ranking
      4 some other tiebreak variant a
      5 some other tiebreak variant b

      posted in New Voting Methods and Variations
      multi_system_fan
      multi_system_fan
    • RE: New voting method? What is 'minmax-TD'?

      @rob you could be right for certain contexts like a state in the US. But I live in The Netherlands and often in these forums many assumptions are made without being aware of them.
      for instance:

      • complexity stemming from incompatible vote counting machines...in NL no vote counting machines are used so this is not relevant
      • political and legal worries: In NL it is not possible for citizens to propose a law, let alone the wording of it. This happens by nonpolitical civil servants in talks with goverment. Many very complex texts become law with minor discussions. Some details may not even have to become law but can be decided by ministers or other functions.
      • the current voting rules in NL have some complex details that almost no-one knows and have never been in mainstream discussions.
      posted in New Voting Methods and Variations
      multi_system_fan
      multi_system_fan

    Latest posts made by multi_system_fan

    • RE: Lottery PR methods compared

      @toby-pereira seems a method is missing that selects randomly ballots and only compares the scores of a random pair (counting only the highest scoring as a winner of that pair).
      Also including a concept like : repeat until chance of statistical unrepresentativeness becomes f.i less then 0,001%

      posted in Proportional Representation
      multi_system_fan
      multi_system_fan
    • RE: Lottery PR methods compared

      @toby-pereira definetly agree there are some good point about random elements in a voting method. Not only because - as you say - it simplifies and achieves PR but also the psychological effect on elected candidates ("luck was part of my succes") may lead to more empathy, humbleness in their policies, and dealing with colleagues and their next campaign.

      posted in Proportional Representation
      multi_system_fan
      multi_system_fan
    • RE: New voting method? What is 'minmax-TD'?

      @rob I understand this problem, altough I doubt simplicity of voting methods or rationality in general will prevent this.
      I'm interested in electionguard software combined with a paper-printed ballot of each vote and the possibility of online checking wheather one's (still anonymous!!) vote is actually tallied. But in this case I do see a similar problem. It's designed to enhance trust but many people would probably distrust everything. For instance because of some connection to Bill Gates.

      posted in New Voting Methods and Variations
      multi_system_fan
      multi_system_fan
    • RE: New voting method? What is 'minmax-TD'?

      @rob you could be right for certain contexts like a state in the US. But I live in The Netherlands and often in these forums many assumptions are made without being aware of them.
      for instance:

      • complexity stemming from incompatible vote counting machines...in NL no vote counting machines are used so this is not relevant
      • political and legal worries: In NL it is not possible for citizens to propose a law, let alone the wording of it. This happens by nonpolitical civil servants in talks with goverment. Many very complex texts become law with minor discussions. Some details may not even have to become law but can be decided by ministers or other functions.
      • the current voting rules in NL have some complex details that almost no-one knows and have never been in mainstream discussions.
      posted in New Voting Methods and Variations
      multi_system_fan
      multi_system_fan
    • RE: New voting method? What is 'minmax-TD'?

      @rob you say "The main thing I think it gets wrong is that it doesn't really account for the diminishing returns on increasing complexity. I doubt that the added complexity of minimax TD over minimax is worth it, when considering issues such as "likelihood of being adopted."
      I have to disagree completely. I'm convinced :

      • "rare complexity" does not interest or worry voters.
      • "rare complexity" does not interest politicians if experts explain to them its rare, fair and not worthy of a political fight for different voting rules.
        So my conclusion: minimax-TD has to become my newest favorite
      posted in New Voting Methods and Variations
      multi_system_fan
      multi_system_fan
    • article implications for number of candidates

      can someone explain https://arxiv.org/pdf/2208.06907 in lay terms?

      posted in Single-winner
      multi_system_fan
      multi_system_fan
    • RE: Proposed options for "voting on voting methods"

      @rob no, I read about it somewhere but can't find it....

      posted in Single-winner
      multi_system_fan
      multi_system_fan
    • RE: Proposed options for "voting on voting methods"

      There's a category of first-step-eliminations before other main popular methods that I would like as a seperate category or vote in another thread.

      As an example I would like to eliminate 35% of the candidates with the lowest (average) scores.

      posted in Single-winner
      multi_system_fan
      multi_system_fan
    • RE: Threshold MES

      @andy-dienes seems like this method comes from US and comparable context. Then it seems like interesting for 3-7 seats. The Netherlands has 150 seats for 20 parties. This method allone does not make much sense since it would be (almost) identical to other proportional systems. So some in between step or other solutions seems neccesary in this context.

      posted in Proportional Representation
      multi_system_fan
      multi_system_fan
    • RE: Alternative to pairwise matrix

      @rob yeah, this is definetely an easier visual then those number-overload!
      I think the easier graphics will allow more complexity in details because voters will feel they already undetsnd "enough" of it to feel good about it.
      Most people don't try understanding every detail, just a good-enough-intuition.

      posted in Voting Methods
      multi_system_fan
      multi_system_fan